Finished Stalingrad chapter. The first mission is wonderfull, one of the best deffensive missions I had played thanks to the tactical retreat. The second mission is good too, a clever way to make deffensive missions. The 3rd mission "no escape" is a pain, almost impossible, a really re-load festival, not because the tigers, but because the stug-F. I lost more tanks to the stugs than to the tigers; is almost impossible to knock down those SPG from the front side. But Ok, I could finish it after some 4 or 5 re-loads.
But I got a little disappointed with this chapter, after so many deffensive mission all I would like was fight through Operation Uranus.

Yeah, unfortunately, there are a lot of defensive missions in MC (maybe even more than offensive ones), while the mod itself is a lot nicer when you are attacking (due to infantry strength), but wrose, I'd say, on defence. IMO, that "reload fiesta" mission had too few guns, and the repeating German assaults are not countered by your own repeating reinforcements, thus you get stretched thin and your lines break.

I do not know what scenario this is based on, but I do know that, in stopping Von Manstein, Malinovsky rationed gasoline to his mobile artillery and infantry, so you should really see a lot more infantry and a good amount of artillery rather than those tanks. Also, the player should get more time and infantry to prepare defences at the start (which is in fact what happened).


I get frustrated a lot quicker when playing BK than when modding it, so I came to a halt at that mission.

Yep, but is ok once the soviet were in the defensive trough 41-43. It's a pitty GordonCZ didnt explore a little more the counter-ofenssives of 1942. Uranus was a master coup and I think the MC gameplay is perfect to this Operation.



But the concept of the mission is good. With thin lines you must use the tanks to block german attacks, covering the opened zones; the problem IMO the mission is a little unbalanced, change the stugs by PZ-III/J and the mission would be perfect.



Oh no! First of all I'm player . And even with some frustated times MC is fantastic.

I have just finished MC.
Holly sh, I had problems in Budapest, hell of a mission
I love new concept, especially because now you can fight with infantry and it matters, not like in original BK. Best thing is when you n
have forest, tank and infantry squad, tank goes on the edge of the forest, infantry in the forest, laying down and ambushing. Beautiful campaign, just like said before, impressive.
Now Gordon, maybe to convert Achtung Panzer to fit the MC mod? I want to finally start German campaign with Pz I and upgrade tanks slowly
Once more

Did you play the entire campaign?

Yup, all from beginning. Every day for hour or more. Why?

Sorry about that mission. From what I've read here, it is probably the worst one I've ever made, so sorry about it. I knew that this mission was very difficult, so I made it easier just few days before releasing MC, but it seems that this change was not deep enough. But still, it serves as a notice for future to me...
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Thanks mates. It boosts me to move the progress of work on an add-on more.
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Actually, that would require to make all the missions again, as the new gameplay needs a changed conception of missions and AP was made for pure BK. So that's probably a sound of a bit far future...
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And where did you find the time for making KS then?

By sleeping 4 or 5 hours a day. That's why I am taking a looong break now.

Only 4-5 hours a day? Then you just deserve some break before collapsing...

I'm in the first mission of Kursk. How many enemy waves should I beat?
BTW, the at squads (with grenates) are almost useless: I send them attack and they keep watching the german tanks... Oh boy, and that Ferdinands

Pretty many. It's purely defensive mission, all filled with defending duties (about 1 or 1 and half hour of defending).

So, after a tiny recon, there are few light attacks (can be taken as for checking the strength of your defences). Then the enemy will launch two main sets of attack waves (while the first one is lighter and the second one will probably surely break through your first defensive line, if the first one didn't). Each one accompanied with longer pause in combat, when the Germans must regroup their forces, so use them also to reinforce and regroup yours. Then only few attacks as a last desperate effort of the Germans to brake through need to be repelled and it's done. In combat, surely don't forget to keep shooting down enemy Stukas all the time.

But one point: don't be affraid when the Germans brake through the first defensive line, as it is intended to be like that. So hold the first line as long as possible, while simultaneously improving defences on the other two defensive lines behind. Also even a single squad left in trench can serve pretty effectively to delay the enemy advance, if necessary. And don't be affraid, reinforcements are on the way.

It's not an easy mission, but if you can take the fact, that after more or less amount of mission time, you will loose the first defensive line and will have to pull back into improved backup lines, then it will be much easier to manage it. This mission simply fully utilizes the need for more than one defensive line combined with the need of mobile reserves including the rules for their proper usage.




That's strange. Doesn't it interfere with some .pak mod that you might have in data folder? Because they normally run for the tank and are able to destroy it pretty quickly. Try to give them offensive formation first.

PS: Also might be caused by the fact, that they simply can run out of AT ammunition as grenades are thrown also at nearby infantry if needed (especially from trenches). Keep those AT squads in larger numbers (min. 2-3) behind the frontline as reserves against heavier tanks. They are really helpful and I haven't encountered this problem, so it might be caused by one of the two above mentioned reasons.

Thanks for your answer. I could secure my lines untill I received the reinforcement, so one single Elefant broke my last lines and I lost.

About the At squads: when I use the "attack target" command they dont attack, when I use the "aggressive movement" comand they can attack, but the problem with the agressive movement is, if some enemy infantry squads is near of the tanks, they will shot at the soldiers instead attack the enemy tanks. BTW, I was just using some skins packs and the infantry certainly had grenates, cause they were in the rear of the front.
If this problem is not exclusively with my installation, maybe you could release a patch, because the infantry against the tanks is less effective than in vanilla.

EDIT: Could win the mission with one single reload , just some 2 or 3 of my tanks survived . But I still cant manage the AT squads properly.

Great to see you did it.

About the AT squads, I really don't know where the problem can be, because whatever I do to find any problem, they just run for the tank and attack it when commanded to do so as usual. I must admit that I'm pretty stuck because I haven't noticed any fault in this. Really strange...

Hi,

In the Kiev mission, after the conquest of the bridgehead I suffered a huge german counter-attack, I could beat it, but now I have just 4 T-34, 3 kv-1/s, 3 lend-lease tanks (valentines, shermans) and some 2 or 3 squads. Is possible to capture the citty with these units? And will I receive reinforcements?
Thanks

Don't worry, comrade. You will receive reinforcements for further advance, including also Czechoslovak forces.

Damn.
I played some custom chapter for RT these days and that was the moment when I realized how used I really got to the MC- gameplay.

When I started shooting with my ari, I suddenly realized all those orange circles.
I thought to myself: "Oh Oh".

I also had real problems with the much more vulnerable infantry. They died like lemmings.

No really, I even like the gameplay of MC more than the original BK- gameplay.
Especially the use of artillery is much more realistic. Love it.

Yes.
And after some initial complaints, now I enjoied the new values of the soviet tanks. For the first time the T-34/42 is a respectable tank (in vanilla it can barelly face the Pz-IV/G), and the Su-76 is not useless anymore. Is not necessary make an unrealistic use of the KV-85 and Su-85 before 44.
The only negative aspect are the SU-122 and Su-152, they are usefull just to ambush the enemy.

Thanks. btw: Working on the addon is already in progress, so I hope you will like it also...

Actually, the same things happen to me when I'm playing any mission designed for the old gameplay. I just sometimes don't immediatelly realize, that I suddenly cannot do some normal things with the old gameplay.

Great to see you like the values now. Those tanks were simply intended to be as you pointed out.

About those SU's, should I release some kind of a small patch fixing it or will it be enough to fix it in the next campaign?

btw: How did you pass Prokhorovka mission (as it is probably harder than Ponyri)?

IMO you could release an optional patch right now. I think is good option have some "improved" SU's to the 43 scenarios, specially against the Elefants.


Prokhorovka was easier than Ponyri. No need to reload and was the first time I could win with a "tank surplus". More than 10 tanks survived. The reason is after Moscow, Stalingrad and Ponyri I finally learned how to use my tanks in deffensive missions: covering the AT guns and using it to attract the enemy to ambush him. Very realistic BTW: the soviets just learned how fight the Blitzkrieg after 1942.
Another reason is in Prokhorovka the espace to be deffended was lesser than Ponryi, so is easier to command my units. Finally, even I still cant have a good performance with my AT squads I used my infantry to confuse the enemy tanks, this is possible just in MC because in vanilla the soldiers die as flies.

What surprise me more is how all the missions have a good balance. Did you test the missions by yourself?? How can you get it? I also was surprised with the deffensive missions, I use to hate this kind of missions, but I have fun with most of MC ones.

I trully believe we should support this mod. When I have time to make maps again I'll make some covering the forgotten soviet battles of 42.

Patch for Su!

Okay then, patch is on the way...

I also thought about some kind of an optional mini-patch solving this and some other minor issues, so I think that the best thing to do, will be to make a patch that would not change the name of the mod (from 1.0 to 1.1) and therefore leave all the opportunities open.




Good to see you done it without problems. I was a bit affraid if the final German attack is not just too powerful.




Well, after your report, I aimed especially on this feature and tested it several times, but everytime the infantry behaves as it should - simply attacks the tank. So I really don't know where the problem can be...

Still, you can try to order your AT squads run towards the tank (manually ordering them "Move" command) and stop them near the tank. They should then throw their AT charges at the tank.




Lets say, that I had to test the missions up to five times to tune them. Also I could also base on the experiences from AP.

The main point of defensive missions in MC is that AI units can now actually achieve a brake-through, which is not only a teoretical possibility, but a real threat. Therefore the defensive tasks counts with more defensive lines and mobile reserves to handle this conception. I simply wanted to make defending more flexible and less static and boring as in vanilla BK. So great to see you like it.




If you would make such missions, it will be superb!

I have two complaints:

Panzerschrecks: it has the same range of the soviet tanks. This is completly unrealistic and in it's first exhibition in Korson really disheartened me... How can I clean a german trench without using "human waves"? In Vanilla I use the 37 mm AA canons and in MC I used the Ba-64, but now...

And why the La-5 are so weak. I lost some of this plane to Stukas!!!

Not at all. The fire range is the same as MGs and light cannons, because otherwise, they would not be able to challenge even that BA-64, which would make them on the other side absolutely useless weapons. So, if you would keep your (medium and heavy) tanks exactly at a distance of fire range of their cannons, you will realize, that Panzerschrecks and Panzerfausts cannot shoot at them.

This feature even more emphasizes the need of infantry support for your armored units. Remember, that infantry AT capability (includes the case of Panzerschrecks) is in MC performed by AT teams, so not every squad has Panzerschrecks, but only those AT teams (2 men in each).

And a tip: Just as in vanilla BK, the best way to counter Panzerschrecks is movement. You stop and you're dead.



Well, these are not that bad planes, actually, but they considerably fall behind the German planes in terms of firepower, so that's probably the reason, as dogfights are handled solely by AI.

Exactly. Plus, while moving tanks, they will open fire with mg-s and therefore preserve shells. As Panzershreck rocket is not guided it's rather easy to do so. I think on Berlin map, I had problems at a bridge, had to really move around )

Yes, I forgot to mention this. Thanks.

Just want to say that MC patch 1.1 is thanks to Lee now available on BKPortal. With other fixes, this patch contains also the fix for SU-122 and other assault SPGs, so they now move and attack the enemy units when ordered to do so.

Details can be found on download page:
http://bkportal.com/default.asp?content=downloads&downloadID=776

Dont want to be dull, but I think the panzerschrecks ranges are unrealistic. I readed it got just 128 mts in real life. I love to play with the soviets but their infantry weapons are so inferior, the MGs are better than the RPDs with those improved panzerschrecks and new infantry value the cleaning of a trench will become extreme boring. Oh boy .

But I didnt had played enough so I can bite my tongue as before...

@Alex: How about your infantry performance against tanks? Am I the only one who has this strange problem?

How about that custom background, Gordon?

I'm quite anxious to play with it!

Well, it's pretty fatiguing answering every single feature of MC, but I'll try.

If you want to be 100% correct than you would have to say that the whole BK is unrealistic. And concerning directly the fire ranges, vanilla BK have almost the same fire range for a rifle as for Tiger tank cannon. The same for Panzerschrecks. I also think that it is not realistic enough, but BK is a game, not a real war. Otherwise, if you would want to have realistic fire ranges, try to imagine that while keeping ranges for rifles the same as they are now, you would have to increase fire range of tank cannons in such way that tanks would be able to shoot through several screens (sometimes that's over the whole map). And than every long-range artillery gun would have to be removed from map, because its fire range would be as several maps together, so the artillery support would be realizable only by an external (off-map) arty support. And if you would do this, you would create a copy of "Theatre of War" WW2 strategy. But you simply can't do it, because BK engine has substantial limitations, that would not allow the game be playable with such settings (mainly because you would not be able to hide your units behind terrain slopes, infantry would not be able to cover itself behind buildings' corners etc. etc.)

And now to Panzerschreck. Its effective fire range was in real up to 180m. That's not pretty far compared to tank cannons, but they could hide and shoot at the enemy tank when it came closer. In BK, these actually shoot also at infantry, so they would be pretty easily spotted and quickly eliminated without even endangering the enemy armored units. The same would be with AT rifles (PzB39, PTRS etc.). I initially set the fire range of both of these AT weapons to 20 (PzSchreck) and 25 (PzB39) tiles. But as MGs had fire range 30 tiles, these AT weapons proved to be almost for nothing very soon when their testing started. The only thing I had do was to spot them with infantry, then retreat and just wait until my tank MG eliminated them from a safe distance. Soon, I realized that it simply would be for nothing to add AT teams onto any map, because with such settings they would be just totally useless. So I had to increase their range to the same range as MG have (30 tiles), to make them capable of defending themselves against the tanks (which is their intention of existence). The fire range of medium tanks are 35 tiles, heavy tanks have 40 tiles, so that's more than any infantry AT weapon, so the tanks when handled carefully still can avoid being destroyed, just try to not shoot at the AT teams with the tank MG. This seems to me the same as if you would complain about the fire range of PTRS or other AT rifles. These are also not realistic, but simply has to be like that for the reasons written above. Rather than stopping at every difference in MC, you'd better try to solve it on your own first. Then you might see that it's not that weird and has its reason why it is like that (as MC has been developed for about a year and in that time, I was working on balancing the gameplay features, which was a huge work, I must say, concerning all the calculations to make everything fitting). It's the same situation as with swapping those T-34 xml files. You didn't like the values and so you removed the files - and now as you said, you put them back.

As you can see, it's pretty complicated and the reasons that I wrote above lead me to make MC as it is (and "what" it is, depends only on everybody's feeling about it).


PS: Please, realize that when the Germans become to be equipped with StG44, then beating the enemy defences will be even worse...




And they do nothing when being next to the enemy tank? That's really weird, because in MC, the throwing range has been even increased...

Haven't you changed anything else besides T-34 xml? Well one idea: Try to look into the "weapons" folder, if you have there a file named "s-inf-at-g.xml" and check if it works (open it). Maybe it's missing or corrupted.